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"In the late 80s prempal did an instructor training course in Penang. One of the particpants there told me that he had some disagreement with someone and made allthe candidates stand uo in a group and videod them saying 'fuck you'.I was told this by Lee Marges, an Australian pwk, who I know to be completely honest.(I doubt that she talks to me now).
Oh yes, Lee herself refused to participate. Anyway, I just wondered if you knew anything about this. Jethro PS apologies to all who have seen this before, I put this info up some time ago. PPS to any Ozs reading this. If you see Lee or Sam Bender(her husband) please tell them to email me on the above email and not be angry with me. I see no reason why what Lee told me should not be made public. Pwk's should know the character of their leader. " I am sorry to say that Lee and Sam just went silent. David Roupell also said he was at the f-u video. Everyone who has lived around him knows how nasty he is.
Related link: http://www.ex-premie.org/best/bof02032001160005.htm#P_174K
Modified by Jethro at Sat, Apr 08, 2006, 09:06:00
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I've browsed the "conference" transcripts a few time on EPO, not all of them, but cannot make sense out of it. Some parts sound distinctly wierd, not to say: indecent. One consistent pattern seemed to be that every time someone dared comment it was viewed as criticism and they were subjected to ridicule and sometimes profane abuse. The entire "conference" seemed to be an extended tirade... with a pledge ending..
Modified by LP at Sat, Apr 08, 2006, 11:35:09
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Thanks, Jethro, I remember it. Read through those old posts too. Virgil was another guy that scared the crap out of me. But, that was just me and men in authority at the time. Yeah, I hope any premies reading this forum realize that when they say ex-premies are a hate-group that they are pepetuating one of Maharaji's urban legends, a myth. It doesn't bother me in a contant nagging way, but premies must know that if they experience any joy, glee, or triumph at labeling us as such and reading my posts today, they really need to search their consciences.
Modified by Cynthia at Sat, Apr 08, 2006, 12:58:11
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Lee Marges refused a direct command of Prem Pal's? Really? Well she passed the course anyway as I recall she was doing speeches in this area as an instructor. I've never heard a bad word said about her.
I wonder if it is possible to understand the extraordinary dead-ends, 180 degree turns, stops and starts of the whole Western mahatma/iniiator/instructor/part-time instructor/DVD operator saga. Talk about a tornado in a tea-cup. As Mahatma Saphlanand was apparently the only Western mahatma and he soon saw the light and left the lotus feet there can't be anyone who has actually lasted the whole course. Is there anybody who has gone the distance from 1974 on? Ira Woods maybe, there was a heavy duty one track mind if I ever saw one.
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Maharaji ordained 4 (or was it five?) Americans as "Mahatmas" in 1975 and as far as I can tell, only Ira Woods is still in the cult. Bill Patterson (Mahatma Satchitanand), left the cult in the 80s or early 90s, and then was in some kind of serious accident and I have heard he is very disabled. I was living in the ashram with Bill Patterson when he got christined, and I remember we got him a set of cowboy clothes, complete with boots and a Stetson, so he would be a true "Western Mahatma." Bill was a true fanatic, but I liked him, he was a nice guy, just annoyingly positive. If I were to pick someone who I would judge as THE LAST person to leave the Rawat cult, it would have been Bill Patterson, but leave he did. Arthur Brigham (Mahatma Gurupujanand (or was that Ira?)) also left the cult, and I heard he was living in Southeast Asia. Maybe his name was Mahatma Hans Jayanti or something. Kathy Sullivan (Pranam Bai), was Rawat's head housekeeper in Malibu, and I heard she left the cult and runs a mobile library truck for the LA Public Library and has a website on which she recommends books. Ira Woods (Mahatma Gurupujanand (or maybe that was Arthur)), is apparently still a card-carrying devotee, last I heard. Around 1977, Rawat started ordaining Westerners and changed the name from "Mahatma" to "Initiator."
Modified by Joe at Mon, Apr 10, 2006, 16:03:40
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I'm pretty sure Arthur Brigham went to gaol here in Australia for a while for drug smuggling or selling offenses. He had moved to the Cairns district in North Qld and was involved in the hosptitality trade but it wasn't profitable enough for him. This would have been the early 1980's.
I remember he rang and had the gall to try to "super-premie" me into giving his girl-friend front row seats at a program with Maharaji. "Arthur who?" "I'm sorry who are you?"
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Yes, I had heard he got in trouble with drugs, but it was second hand information so I didn't want to mention it. Arthur was a true pompous ass. That's it: Mahatma Pompousassanand. Now I remember.  Ira was also a fanatic. I always thought he had the look of Tony Perkins in Psycho. I think he was a cab driver in NYC before he became a professional premie.
Modified by Joe at Mon, Apr 10, 2006, 16:52:13
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Seems ... I remember him playing the sitar.... or has my memory begun to get carried away .....?
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Modified by LP at Mon, Apr 10, 2006, 17:50:44
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When he was in Australia he often mentioned beng a NY cab driver. Actually he had some pretty funny lines which he delivered in a monotone deadpan. ACtually, everything he said was in a monotone deadpan. I've got some tapes of his satsangs I'm going to digitise and have a listen to if they don't self destruct on opening.
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Any one remember hearing of Kathy's daring escape from the res. at Trancas, when she ran down the south west side with fire threatening to engulf her from either direction, when fiery Santa Anna winds blew over taking out his motor home, model 'T' ford etc... etc.... and every cactus in the canyon!
Modified by LP at Tue, Apr 11, 2006, 05:02:36
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Cynthia, You wrote at Wikipedia that I am an online gentleman. Even I think that this is untrue, at least in Wikipedia. I guess I am more of a combination between a tireless rebutter, a duelist, and a eagle scout. What type are you? Andries
Modified by Andries at Sat, Apr 08, 2006, 10:12:24
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I don't dare say, Andries, because I've been called the worst.  That website is funny. Hope you're well (aside from being a tireless, dueling scout).
Modified by Cynthia at Sat, Apr 08, 2006, 10:32:39
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(Jim, I hope you do not mind, but this was just too funny not to post. Andries) Atheist is Deacon's cyber-doppelganger. Deacon and Atheist hold equally fervent, though diametrically opposed beliefs about religion, and both feel compelled to share those beliefs at every possible opportunity. Should an unsuspecting forum member make even a passing comment about faith or spirituality of any flavor, Atheist will descend like one of the Furies, mercilessly hectoring all of the ignorant and delusional believers about the sordid history of the church and the pernicious effects of religion on society. After a few of Atheist’s anti-religious jeremiads most other Warriors will avoid the subject altogether, though Evil Clown may egg him on a little, and Philosopher may amuse himself by pointing out flaws in his reasoning. If a forum has the misfortune of having both Deacon and Atheist as members, the bickering often continues until Nanny or Admin pulls the plug. Bliss Ninny can also sometimes squelch the conversation by saying, “Well, everyone has a right to their [sic] opinion.”
Related link: Mike Reed charicatures "The Atheist"
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The "seat", if you will, of premie paranoia, obviously comes from the top down. Why don't they just get over it? If they indeed have the "Knowledge of all knowledges", what the hell else matters?
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