Hi Maria77,

Between the lines, I picked-up on your fear or apprehension concerning violating the terms of your NDA. I've certainly felt similar fears and I know many others, if not nearly everyone in the cult, have as well. Some former followers warn other former followers to be very careful, if not fearful, as if they even need to be warned.

Typically, NDAs are used to protect trade secrets, research and other information that may relate to competitive advantage. In Prem Rawat's case, however, with the exception of the proprietary techniques, which are themselves relatively common, what could those trade secrets or other types of information possibly be? Everything the cult does lies (no pun intended) somewhere between average and what's minimally expected of a professional organization, so I doubt there's anything technically or in any other way exceptional behind it. So what's so important that it needs to be kept secret and why so many NDAs?

Insofar as Prem Rawat is concerned, beginning with the fact that many in his inner circle of followers had to be "X-rated" to prevent them from divulging his personal behavior that they witnessed, the mention of NDAs that I've heard of has almost always been in the context of concealing his behavior. (More recently, there have been hints of concealing financial dealings.)

The cloud of fear that permeats this cult is obvious to anyone who's experienced it or looked for signs of it. And what about the notion of a cult peace movement having enemies? Where does all that fear come from? Perhaps it all goes back to the heading on ex-premie.org:

Again, where does all that fear come from? The fear of:

• describing to another person something disturbing about Prem's behavior or any aspect of that cult.

• what might happen if a person breaks an NDA.

• retribution.

• being sued.

• openly criticizing Prem Rawat or expressing or even acknowledging a doubt.

• allowing yourself to even be exposed to uncomfortable or shocking truths about Prem Rawat.

• what might happen if you stop practicing Knowledge.

• breaking that inner connection to Prem Rawat, the one rife with dialogue and even prayers.

• being stigmatized, ostracized, shunned or branded.

• (all the way back to) what might happen to a follower who leaves the ashram to go back into "the world."

• being banned from serving my Lord if I didn't pass a test.  

Prem Rawat's words, not mine, and just a few of his many dark admonitions.

Any premie who's been around awhile who won't admit to such dark thoughts from time to time is lying. What the hell is going on! What's all that about? I thought this was all about peace! What can possibly engender so much fear, the kind of fear that Will and his associate (neutral San Ysidro conference facilitaors) observed when, according to Michael Dettmers, Will said:

How ironic that for the corrupt followers (not all of them), practicing Knowledge, i.e., withdrawing into oneself, turns into some sort of mental construct used to wall oneself off from one's own behavior, especially when it's knowingly wrong, immoral or unethical. Knowledge: a scoundrel's last place of refuge. Insulated from guilt and shame, assuming they're capable of those feelings, by the "sword of His Knowledge and the shield of his grace."

Indeed, fear, compartmentalization, suppression, denial and lies are all hidden hallmarks - the destructive underbelly - of life in that cult. Are these the "fruits" by which ye/we shall know him? (He's the one who also said we will know him by his fruits.)

My point, if I even have one, is this: how convenient that all the fear engendered by Prem Rawat that spreads explicitly or implicitly like a virus from infected follower to infected follower serves no purpose other than to prevent the truth about his behavior from reaching the public and to keep his followers locked in place. Behavior that, in my opinion, is diametrically opposed to his message of peace.

Indeed, the fear is so rampant that those speaking out are the last people who need to be warned or cautioned to "be careful," as if they aren't already concerned enough about it... as if thay hadn't come from that environment. I'm sure there are posters on this forum who harbor shadows of that fear to this very day.

Why can't the followers who would vehemently disagree with everything I'm saying and emphatically declare it all to be about love and peace, the ones who can't bring themselves to confront the truth about Prem Rawat's behavior, acknowledge their own fear of breaking that connection or (like the three monkeys) even allow themselves to be exposed to it? Again, that kind of fear only serves the interests of their master: it paralyzes them, keeps them trapped, keeps them from talking and conceals his behavior.

I could spend all day going on and on about this. Why? Once the fog of my cult indoctrination, fear being a part of it, wore off, I was able to look back with a clear head and see that I was badly abused by Prem Rawat and many of his closest acolytes. Now I look back on it with utter disgust and revulsion.

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I'm sorry, Maria 77. Please don't think I'm patronizing you or anyone else with what everyone already knows. And I know I didn't even attempt to answer your questions. Your fear or at least your apprehension concerning violating the terms of your NDA is certainly justified. It's just that I wanted to say something to let you know how much I appreciate your contributions here. Obviously a lot.

As others have said, please proceed with caution and sound legal advice in the appropriate jurisdictions. I'm not a lawyer but my common sense tells me that truth is not defamation.

Bob

Thank you. This is so important and something that is so hard to express and you did it perfectly.

I for one, am pretty much terrified of the cult and Prem Rawat. I was when I left the ashram and put a letter on my bed and went outside without telling a soul, and my mom came to get me. She never said I told you so. I love you mom. 

I felt lost. I burned photos of Prem Rawat to prove to myself I would not burst into flames.

When I read that Miami Herald article with the Mishler quote about Prem Rawat ordering two followers to strip nude and poke each others penises with sticks. I went and talked to the reporter, because it terrified me that it could somehow be related to why Jagdeo had not been pulled from his duties. I was too terrified to let him use my name. I told you all, he remembers me. The shadow of Pat Halley and Fakiranand. I was terrified.  

When I reported Jagdeo the second time, within the cult to Judy Osborne about 1982, I was terrified, but I thought, how could it be good for Prem Rawat to have this man traveling for him? Why would he want that even for selfish reasons? I was terrified. Too terrified to go to the police. But I summoned at least the courage to try again within the cult.

When I heard Bob and Eileen Mishler had been killed in a plane crash, I didn't know the story then that it was a medical evacuation that didn't sound like it could have been planned. I thought it possible it was like Fakiranand.

When I posted here the first time under a pseudonym, I was very scared. Not the level of fear as those previous things. But scared.

When Dettmers helped me to get the letter through, I was terrified. My first and last name were there, and here, for all to see. I was afraid of every car that went by my window and drew the blinds. I was afraid I had put my kids at risk. I was very very afraid. I did it anyway. I thought it might spare children the same thing I knew had happened to A. and others I knew of, and what would have happened to me if I hadn't realized Jagdeo knew exactly what he was doing because he was trembling. I dont believe he was trembling with fear.

I did call the Coral Way Miami police in 2000, so many premies were if this is true why didn't you call the police?

The first time I reported Jagdeo I didn't call the police because I knew that Guru Maharaj Ji was the right person to tell. He was the superior power in person. They weren't. I was 15.

 In 1982, really,  back them the police were so likely to believe this weird tale about a weird cult and a Mahatma, and I would incur the wrath of the cult because I besmirched Maharaji's reputation and I knew, nothing was likely going to happen because who knew what country or state Jagdeo was in. I didn't know his last name, heck I didn't know if Jagdeo was really his first name. I didn't think the cult would turn him over, but I did think the cult might threaten me. My husband then, worked at DECA. I had two babies. I was terrified.  I don't think my risk benefit assessment was so way off. 1982 in Miami was cocaine cowboy time, and the height of the heavy devotional trip.  Even now all you have to do is watch documentaries about the failures of police to protect victims in such cases.

in 2000, the report in writing, I asked them to send their response to Dettmers, not me, even though I knew they likely knew exactly where I lived and all about me, because the idea of being contacted directly scared me. But I wasn't so scared I wouldn't have been interviewed, all I asked was for a witness because the two previous people I told "forgot" what I told them. I thought I needed a witness. They never asked any more questions of me.

When Shana contacted me I was terrified. For them and for me. Still I tried to help. And I was not free to discuss it then. I will not discuss what I did do here. At least not until they speak more. But she was very afraid and so was I.

When I met Shana in Miami in 2019 I sent a letter to my son with all the info about what I where I was going and why and when to expect me back at the hotel, in case something happened to me. I was afraid. 

I could go on and on. I like that you are calling this fear out. 

No one should think they are not afraid. Or I am not afraid. I know at least some of the people who are standing with us are afraid too. 

A reminder to be careful. It doesn't help that fear. You can't do anything about this and really not take some risks.,  The Prem Rawat organization, as you said so well, thrives on fear. Thrives on that fear keeping people silent. 

We do need to talk about the fear. But we don't need to scare each other more. As you said, being sufficiently afraid isn't the problem here. 

The shame is on the people who scare us.

Also I was ill two minutes ago when I saw the JM post and thought it referred to JM from France not JM from Australia. They got to someone else? My stomach dropped. 

I think I am afraid enough. 

That sounds like a flashback of an actual living nightmare, the "nasty side" of himself that he described that gives rise to all the fear being discussed... the legitimate and real fear that you describe.

I gather from your being subject to an NDA, having nightmares of being backstage with him and your hints of other things you can't talk about, that you were close. I really look forward to the day when you can tell your story and even if it never comes, congratulations on your escape! It even makes me breathe easier.

A few nights ago, in vivid, full motion living color, I dreamed I was in a small living room overlooking a street we once lived on. Two "new people" were attending a small introductory gathering. Sandwiched between two people, I was curled-up on a couch drifting in and out of sleep. When it was my turn, I stood-up and gave my best animated and impassioned satsang, waving my arms, hand gestures and all. Fortunatly, I can't remember a word I said.

The wierd part is that while I was asleep, I dreamed I was falling asleep and waking up again.

Like Mike Finch once said, "it steeps into your pours."