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In reading the posts from FK,( I'm quite sure who he is, but won't speculate on the forum at this point) I sense a kind of blown opportunity for both FK and others on the forum.
I remember when Mike Dettmers first came on the forum....it was uncertain at first, then a lot of back and forth defensiveness on both sides, but then some really meaningful, deep conversations happened that really helped a lot of people process stuff...it was quite remarkable for many of us!
In reading FK's posts, even his last one, he seems to genuinely want to reach out and communicate with people on the forum, but in a civil way.....I totally agree...
Is there a way that you, Mike Roark, see this happening?
I think it could be good, but maybe both sides got off to a shaky start here...could we do a re-start here, or is too far gone, in your opinion...
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Okay, come back FK. Maybe it wasn't FK's agya; maybe it was MATA JI's. [This is an old old basoc ex argument without a clear answer: It was HIS [GMJ's] fault/doing. It was HER fault/doing -- evertything that happened in the "West".] She turned Jagdeo from a humble little guy off the Air India airplane at JFK with his little cloth bag into an ego maniac / child molester and just a weird weird melodramatic, over-pendantic satsang-giver. His twisting thumb and forefinger, his always too long speeches, his twisting logic that made people want to scream, his twisting eyes, sneer, lisp, speech impediment, Queen's English, all too much for me to take!!!! When he returned from his first trip shortly after he arrived in America -- a weekend at the Westbury Long Island residence and seeing Mataji "in the West". He then made everyone sit below him when he returned to 85th St Ashram in NYC, as he was instructed, as he was told he was above the regular premies, and they needed to never forget this. She had told him that premies were for his use; they were HIS servants. Not the Lord's servants, but the Mahatmajis', Jagdeo's. What a crappy dissonance these guys brought (and the lovely Moni Bai). Lil Darlin freaked. He used to read the poems and eat anything. When he returned from his visit with Mataji, he demanded tea at a certain temperature, like the other Mahatmaji's and demanded snacks. He took on an air of superiority. Lil Darlin commented to him that he was humble like a lamb upon arrival from India, but now after his Long Island visit he was like a lion, roaring out commands and demands. And his response was "Oh, Lil Darlin, you are so right." He had a moment of clarity and self-awareness. But reverted quickly to a big shot asshole. It shocked Lil Darlin that she blurted this out. She was so shocked and stunned that it just came out, despite the fact the she knew she was expected to just respect him in his knew role. FK COME BACK He traveled around the world and brought pain. He was sick. Western Mahatmas, were a bad idea that just got worse. Believe me, I was one, and I ain't not Bill Patterson or Ira Woods (or Kathy Sullivan for that matter.) Must have been a clerical error. Jagdeo was a sinister character always lurking everywhere with his weird smirk/smile and folded palms with a natural bobble of the head.
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One ex-premie I know says that Jagdeo told him that he(Jagdeo) was a reincarnation of a past perfect master.
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my initial reaction was to laugh then a little bit of sick in my mouth
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-26556395
The guy in the link was originally a mahatma of prempal called Ved Praktanand, was sent back to India for sexual misconduct, became a mahatma of satpal, then became a satguru himself."He led the Divya Jyoti Jagrati Sansthan (Divine Light Awakening Mission) which claims more than 30 million followers."
Seems like he was more popular than all the Rawat's put together. He was always laughing when he gave satsang, had a very large stomach and many of us was sure he was the Buddha reincarnated. We worshipped the mahatmas in the early years, but then prempal reduced them to initiators followed by instructors followed by DVDs of him.
6:45am Anyway, I've just been out for a daybreak walk and will soon go for early morning swim. Cheers.
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Now kept in freezer at his ashram while the devotees work out if he is dead or in Samadhi!
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A real devotee knows that the perfect master never dies 
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I read an article - it's closely contested. If he is dead then his will comes into effect and his rather large estate goes into their hands. But if he is in Samadhi then the current administrators retain power over it.
I can only imagine the 'let's stuff our beloved in the freezer and say he's not dead' scene!
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The succession problem is a large part of the reason there are so many of these guru cults in India. From just a couple a century or so ago, now there are multiple dozens, hundreds for all I know, because every time one of these godbothering shitheads dies, who inherits the spiritual mantle & who inherits the lifetime's accumulated serf loot becomes a major bone of contention, especially if the guy has a wife & children. The result is a splitting of the movement with each bit claiming legitimacy & a new guru needed to head it up.
The solution to this in the Catholic church was clerical celibacy. They'd sorted out the spiritual succession problem many centuries earlier by having Popes.
Modified by PatD at Wed, May 17, 2017, 16:15:15
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The Catholic Church is huge isn't it and the wealth piled up in the Vatican legendary.
In past times they've had a political stranglehold on power in Europe. It was pretty amazing the way Henry VIIIth challenged it so successfully. I wonder if a lot of Britain's wealth of former times didn't come from that challenge.
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That is really interesting.Islam also never solved that aspect. Prophet Mohamet did not suggest anything to this regard. And right there and then at his death, split and murderous fights ensued..which never stopped since. That was true in the Moghols royal families also...brothers murdering each other for lack of clear rules on succession.
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Hi Jethro,
I want to know more about ved Praktananda , like his personality, his discourses , he as a person. And details whether he chose to return back or was sent back?
Thanks
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I wanted to respond to this post because of my more recent experiences of Jagdeo. Many of you will have read my stories before but for the benefit of newcomers .. and because I was recently talking about him with a friend who also had a lot to do with him in the mid nineties in the Delhi Ashram.We were part of the vanguard team who went out weeks ahead of major events there to set up facilities for western premies. He didn't live with the other mahatmas but in an accommodation block which was reserved for the more VIP premies during the events. She and I shared a room in this block and spent weeks with only a handful of us and him sharing a table at mealtimes. There is no doubt that he lived a life of great privilege and demanded a huge amount of attention. He was waited on hand and foot by the housekeeping staff including very young boys and girls. His needs or desires came before any of their other duties. And I am pretty sure he was making sexual demands of at least one young woman. It really makes me feel sick to realise in hindsight what was going on. Anyway, the bastard's dead now and so is the battery on my phone! So I'll leave it there.
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yeah really - what a crew - Jagdeo, Rawat, Sampuranand. It is mind boggling now to think we looked up to them.
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I have 3 friends still imprisoned after 40+ years. One is happy that despite low wages, he gets to be a biggy taking care of the Malibu Palace. Another was stalked by a known creep after she broke off relationship with him. Other women w/same experience w/creep guy didn't tell her because it might reflect negatively on the former guru.
Finally back in my DC days, Jagdeo was often around. Have(had) a friend who had a little girl who had a rough time later in her teenage years. I suggested to her that Jagdeo the pervert might have done a number on her. She no longers wishes to speak to me.
I imagine there are many 40+ years folks who have stories to tell if only they would wake up.
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Hey la-ex,
Sorry for my delay in answering.
I doubt he will resurface here, but I guess we'll see.
It would have been interesting to see his personal accounts added to the already overwhelming body of lore that discredits GMJ's integrity along with the idea there is anything special to what and how he teaches.
best, Mike
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