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Rawat feeds premies' nostalgia for the past (for the old-timers) who remember the previous Amaroos and Kissimmee fests when Rawat would drive by in his Jeep or Range Rover. Premies flock to in "His" place, so they can sang openly worship him. They sang arti, kissed Rawat's feet, and blissed out on the group high. Here's a link to the "traveling kpeople's initiative" blog: 
Related link: TPI
Modified by Cynthia at Tue, Oct 10, 2006, 14:12:53
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One of the photos is m laughing. From his point of view he has good reasons to laugh, he is still in business. His looks reflects his personality.
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How old is he? He really looks like shit. I thought he was, like 48 years old or something. Does he have a mirror? Does he think claiming to be the perfect master is going to save his ass when that life-style come home to roost? Jeezuz. Just because not a leaf moves without his willing it, does he suppose he is going to reverse the effects of what he's apparently doing to his body: clogged arteries, high cholesterol, high blood pressure, etc.? Oh, wait, hang on. I think I got it. He looks that way because he sucks all the bad stuff away from his premies, right? And takes it all in to his own body? Am I on the right track here? What a crock of crap that would be, even if anybody claimed it. Not even the most brainwashed premie could go for that bullshit. By the way, who is that poor bastard holding the umbrella? Jeez, talk about "If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all..." That guy is getting screwed. Do you suppose he knows it? Is his lardship too lazy, too out of shape or just to friggin' above it all to hold his own umbrella? It's not like he needed his hands free to shake hands or sign autographs or touch people. He's not doing any of that. If he is so friggin' holy he can't even hold his own umbrella, why doesn't he just make a little cloud follow him around? Simpler, right? Okay, that's it for me. I'm going to go puke now.
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Hi Premie Spouse,
good to hear the clear uninhibited voice of someone who has never been tamed (even temporarily) by maharaji's influence, yet knows first hand of the damage he does to lives.
"If he is so friggin' holy he can't even hold his own umbrella, why doesn't he just make a little cloud follow him around?"
Inspired
Modified by Saph at Tue, Oct 10, 2006, 14:03:06
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Hilarious! Get that cloud to follow him around!!
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that's the term for the ill health of that face. Seriously, he looks in ill health.
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In patients who chronically abuse alcohol, clinical and biochemical findings suggestive of Cushing syndrome are often encountered. Discontinuation of alcohol causes disappearance of these abnormalities, and, therefore, this syndrome often is specifically referred to as alcohol-induced pseudo–Cushing syndrome.
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I think I got it. He looks that way because he sucks all the bad stuff away from his premies, right? And takes it all in to his own body? Am I on the right track here? What a crock of crap that would be, even if anybody claimed it. Not even the most brainwashed premie could go for that bullshit. Don't kid yourself.
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I lived with him in the ashram. We all know him. I was castigated badly for a snide remark on F7 I made about him 5 years ago, which I thought was misinterpreted and taken out of context (sure, ots). He is and will always be my "brother" and I love him unconditionally as a fellow human, because that's who he is -- open and real all the time. He's one of my favorite people. Like a Guiliani or a Tannenbaum or the late Anne Bancroft. Sadly, in the picture, BELIEVE ME, he is having the fcukin time of his life. So happy, he could plotz right there. He is a 35 year devotee (with a capital D). A failed effort in my opinion, however. Like Hanuman, he just holds the umbrella. That's one lonely and sad bunch, those Elvan Vital (non)members, because they evidently don't care about each other -- only their individual "experience" and the giver of "that gift." But only 70 percent of the time. Thirty percent, they're just regular people, like everyone else. So there's a lack of love around this cult. (I think they hate the "c" word more than anything in the world.) And here's where I disagree out loud with Mr. JOXHose, or whatever his name is, sorry. This "Knowldedge" with a Capital K: It's really the booby prize -- not a GIFT, as JOX says. You BELIEVE, Joxy, that it's a great great gift and it gives you blah blah blah --you're brainwashed, my boy. And don't foget the two versions -- 24/7 holy name and 15 minutes a day holy name. ("Oh, but that's my expeirence." Sure, Joxy). And you're very sure in your beliefs that the giver of that gift should be adored for life and that the propogation of this gift to others would be righteous for a human being to endeavaor, so you propagate. Wrong, I believe. It's just regular meditation techniques. Who cares. It obviously (to me) doesn't bring peace to you, Jox, and those of your ilk, nor did it really do it for me after 30 years. Mentally induced devotion was the only thing I thrived on. I loved going to Australia. Loved my devotion for 30 years. I can understand it. But I now loathe it. No one is interested outside of their little cult in the message and the messenger. It's so friggin secret, still. And so, who cares? That's why propagation is the greatest scam of his of all time. It's the blueprint, not the failure, that continues to bring in the dollars. His new charitable works are just a taxman's instructions on holding on to as much of his money as possible.
Modified by OTS at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 18:36:22
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I love the title and the energy of this post OTS.It should be a thread header not hidden down here. " Loved my devotion for 30 years " I know what you mean.We were all the umbrella guy sometimes.
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Hey OTS, Sadly, in the picture, BELIEVE ME, he is having the fcukin time of his life. So happy, he could plotz right there. He is a 35 year devotee (with a capital D). A failed effort in my opinion, however. Like Hanuman, he just holds the umbrella. I thought the same thing about Umbrella Guy. Anything to be nearest to the god-in-a-bod. It's sad, but true. Hope you're well, Cynthia
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You will find a freakish man of the same age who is a former boy God with sycophants carrying umbrellas.
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How observant of you Susan,
I never connected those two before as contemporaries. But what similarities, (apart from waist size) they are both truly freakish and each has done it to himself. And now they seem to be on the downhill side of their opulence.
By the way I went several times looking for that thread you mentioned about entitlement, I think I remember, but don't remember seeing mindscapes.
Best wishes
Saph.
Modified by Saph at Tue, Oct 10, 2006, 15:48:43
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yes, waistlines quite difference but both paranoids surrounded by sycophants. Both were "child stars" and lost cache as they aged... I found the website. I don't really like the whole website but I do really like this one page. I just have always wondered what created the Maharaj Ji monster ( since he wants to call us monsters I think he looks and acts like a monster ) and these are interesting ways to look at the guru phenomenon. http://www.lorinroche.com/page8/page95/page95.html this was my favorite part "You Are God – Actually, Greater than God"
Imagine that you have been raised to believe you are God. You were born into a little village in India and your mother had a dream when you were in the womb, that a cow jumped over the moon. A wandering naked sadhu walked by, stoned out of his mind, and interpreted the dream as meaning that the child is the Lord of the Universe. More importantly, the sadhu said, some day this child will send millions of rupees back to the village. The village loaded the sadhu up with as much ganga and mangoes as he could carry and sent him on his way before he changed his mind.
The entire village of 80 people, none of whom can read or have ever heard of the United States, and who believe that the jets flying overheard are gods, sign on to this enterprise. You the child are raised to believe he is Lord of the Universe. They put you on a throne and worship you once a week, offering rice, coconuts and beetel leaf and praising you as the Incarnation
When the child is 15, the village scrapes together every rupee they can and send you to a religious festival. An American hippie wakes up from a coma resulting from a bad LSD trip, dysentery, and dengue fever. As he comes to, he sees a group of people genuflecting at you and he catches your eye. He interprets your empty-headed gaze of mild curiosity as Divine Love. He feels better. Then this hippie, who is actually the son of the head of one of the biggest media corporations in the United States, adopts you as his guru and arranges for you to tour the US. Soon you have thousands of devoted followers, then hundreds of thousands. All the Americans, almost, bow down to you, as is your natural status. Soon you have tens of millions of American dollars in your many offshore accounts, and you generously pay to have a pump installed in the village well back home.
But there are a few troubling signs. Not everyone bows down to you in absolute submission, as they did in your village. Also, you hear that people are actually daring to doubt your divinity, and even - gasp - criticize you. You find this very disturbing. "How dare these low-caste Americans, who are not worthy to even kiss my lotus feet, think such thoughts of me?" Most of these you can brush off like mosquitoes in the monsoon season, but some of them come up again and again. Sometimes you frown in irritation.
One day one of your devoted henchmen, of whom there seem to be a dozen, always jockeying for position, says, "Is something troubling you, Lord?"
You mention, "Such and such a person is causing me grief."
"I'll take care of it," the henchman says.
You never want to know the details, but the henchmen hire lawyers, spend millions of your hundreds of millions persecuting all your ex-followers that want to talk about their experiences with you, hire private detectives to create dossiers on all your critics, and create their own GOD'S PLUMBERS group to put the hurt on anyone who does not cave in when the subtle threats are given.
Years later, subpoenas are issued for some of your henchmen because they are murder suspects, but they get word in advance and escape to India, where they go on "spiritual retreat."
You deny all knowledge.
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Both like to cut a rug wearing funny clothes too! 
Modified by Saph at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 09:50:20
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that one didn't even occur to me...but similar family dynamics of the brothers ( older ) being jealous of yet dependant on the talent of the youngest. Wow...pretty weird. Wonder if somewhat could edit a video to make it look like Rawat is moonwalking in the mala....
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I didn't see that,
Rawat moonwalking in mala: now I have to see it!
But I fear it would take a master editor.
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I think it would be more apt to have him doing "Thriller", though.
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thriller excellent...instead of nice boy from date turns into monster...in Mala
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This attachment is by Frederic... the Lord making a mix.
Modified by Hilltop at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 03:56:26
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ahem. By Frederic eh, Hilltop? You sure?
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Hi Cq, I'm sorry about that. Is the Prem Rawat chemist one yours? That one (young Prem Rawat attacks) is yours. Some of the very best photo humor has been done by you and I haven't forgotten that fact. Remember this money one? I saved your work whenever you posted them here... because they are so funny to me. I can't find the dracula one darn. Best Thoughts.... Hilltop
Modified by Hilltop at Fri, Oct 13, 2006, 18:41:36
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Hi Fiona, I'll think about it and sure I could do it. But that's only my ego and worthless mind talking (according to Prem Rawat). So I'll have to spend some time poking my eyes for peace first. Hey? What about Harry Potter, that's still popular right? Best Thoughts! Hilltop
Modified by Hilltop at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 04:17:17
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I need to update that Harry Potter picture with a more recent picture of Prem Rawat. Now we are talking scarry!
Modified by Hilltop at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 03:49:15
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Modified by Hilltop at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 04:00:16
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Modified by Hilltop at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 04:39:56
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When something is funny, it's just plain funny. We don't laugh at the planets or the galaxies or the sun or things which truly are awesome.
Down through the ages laughter has always been the sword of the common people. Sometimes it is the only tool they have to ensure that their mind is not oppressed though their bodies may be.
Thus it is with those who place themselves in authority: pomposity is the natural target for the laughter of the oppressed. It is a release and the beginning of the march to freedom.
For this reason it should be feared by oppressive leaders and their mesmerised followers, though it is quite harmless and indeed, extremely beneficial to everyone else.
Modified by Saph at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 08:35:43
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You are stars in my world as all of you are who dare to be honest with, and true to, what you know in your hearts to be right.
Modified by Saph at Fri, Oct 13, 2006, 06:55:06
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Hi Saph, Thanks for posting that. They are amazing as you are too! I enjoy reading your posts and you are a HUGE plus to the forum. I'm saving those fantastic photos btw. Too cool! Here's a few photos of insects up close. Thanks again. Your friend... Hilltop
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Thanks Hilltop, those photos are eqalling amazing on another scale.
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"That's one small step for a man, one giant leap for mankind." (Neil A. Armstrong)anagram:
A thin man ran; makes a large stride; left planet, pins flag on moon! On to Mars!
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"Just because some of us can read and write and do a little math, that doesn't mean we deserve to conquer the universe". (Vonnegut) anagram:
A masquerade can cover a sense of what is real to deceive us; to be unjaded and not lost, we must, then, determine truth.
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"To be or not to be: that is the question, whether tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune". (Shakespeare) anagram:
In one of the Bard's best-thought-of tragedies, our insistent hero, Hamlet, queries on two fronts about how life turns rotten. truly amazing world!
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Could you put m's face on the monster in the box - the one that takes the form of the viewer's deepest fears (but can be banished with the magic word, "ridiculous" ? Seriously Hilltop, you weave a great banishing spell with these pictures. Much more effective than sticking your fingers in your eyes, if you ask me. Thank you - and best thoughts to you! Fiona
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Hi Fiona, That's a good idea but which one? There are a few of them like the spider or the one Harry Potter had to deal with. I like the clown myself. Thank you for your kind words. Sincerely, Hilltop
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I'd love to see this one with m's head superimposed on the clown, with m's face semi-transparent so we can see the evil clown head behind the evil clown. Now THAT I think would be very apt, no? Thank you so much for all the funny things you do for us here. Your pictures are great. Best, Fiona
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I like your artwork.
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What has happened to his face?
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just what I thought, it actually triggers involuntary feelings of discomfort in my own body to look at some of those pics of a face I was once familiar with. It's as if his aging is accelerating alarmingly. Shudder.
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Wow, he looks so drawn and tired-looking. When I see those pictures, I don't recognize a thing. He looks like a completely different (old and not very healthy) person.
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Be kind: He is just too exhausted persuing the next million to protect his personal acquired wealth. I see: Lack of peace. Lack of Human grace. Unhealthy. Lack of dignity. All what he is missing reflects on his face/body. Premies would think he look bad because he works so hard. Alcohol in excess can do that to you.
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Much as I loved the fantasy of hordes of premies all acting like proud grandmas (hey! I had one of those wear 'em-to-work baby pictures for all three of mine, and I wore them proudly), I'm afraid that picture the guy is wearing is a picture of the guy who's wearing it. If you click on the photo you will get an enlarged version and you can clearly see it's some kind of photo-id. Too bad. I preferred the idea of them all going home with M necklaces on, like little kids who get a souvenir of the field trip...
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My poor mind. Thanks for telling me that.   For security reasons everybody needs an ID. I get it. He is afraid alright. He knows who he is and that grace is not just a word and neither is KARMA. Be well, A
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That's not M's photo. It's a picture of its owner on his smart card. Kabir
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Yeah, Fiona told me. Thanks anyway.
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Even uglier than the obvious effect this has had on his face, is the inner state of his mind, his secret thoughts, and real opinion of premies, his actual level of bliss or lack thereof, his true motivation and hidden needs.
And worse his hidden store, somewhere deep in his inaccessible conscience; of reasons to know that the dream did not work.
Many times more people have suffered indescribable inner anquish and damaged connections; to the realities of their human life, and to the society around them; than are smiling in his field.
I feel sure that somewhere in his psyche he knows that, out there, a mass of disappointed and disgruntled premies draws inexorably closer to toppling over into recognition and admission of the failure of his western mission and an eventual mass migration into ex-premiehood.
His smiles do not look at all genuine. There is worry there. What would this mean to him financially? What would it do to his ego? What about his calling, his "agya from Shri Hans"?
Uglier still are the thoughts expressed in his face, faithfully and accurately contributing to his eerie appearance. I hope I never have to see him in the flesh again, photos are painful enough.
It reminds me of the end of "Whittaker" in that old 50's BBC radio show, Journey into Space by Charles Chilton. Was it Lemmy who exclaimed: "Oh my god, he's turning into an old man before our eyes"?
Modified by Saph at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 07:24:52
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Modified by Axis at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 13:09:44
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Really! Where are his eyes? his face looks like a mask.
That was the moment, perhaps, when his image took it's first scratch or maybe a minor dent, but nothing like the freeway pileup for the mission, that ensued.
Some shaving foam, big deal, I bet he wishes he got over it, and managed to convince his servants to get over it too. Now.
Or he could have gone "Bwah hah ha, scraped some off and thrown it back at Pat playfully, quickly wiped himself off and carried on with a grin. But that still leaves the problem of devotees who actually did give their minds.
Here's where you separate the men from the gods. An ordinary human person with no grandiose ego could have laughed it off..
Modified by Saph at Thu, Oct 12, 2006, 09:34:33
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Really! Where are his eyes? his face looks like a mask. His face is a mask that he's never taken off. That photo tells me a big story. Rawat was lost to himself at a very early age. Dark, darker, darkest. There's no light in his eyes -- nobody's home.
Modified by Cynthia at Fri, Oct 13, 2006, 07:10:48
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A very significant portent.
Modified by Saph at Fri, Oct 13, 2006, 08:42:13
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he's one of David Icke's 'lizard people'!
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There are two aspects to Knowledge: (1) meditating to obtain higher Truth and Love (2) the relationship of devotee and master These photographs from Amaroo are all about (2), and they remind me what it was like for me to follow Rawat as the Master. Basically, it was unfulfilling, even painful, for me, because Rawat is always so far away. The closest most students ever get is this kind of rare moment when Rawat is standing within shouting distance and you get to look at each other. I finally realized, ironically, that for my own peace of mind I had to divorce Rawat and get a real personal life. I feel pity looking at people who are still trying to feel close to Rawat. The whole relationship is a charade, in my opinion, based upon an idealised view of a guru-figure and an idealised, imaginary relationship. It is both amusing and disturbing to look closely at these photographs and see what is happening. For instance, Rawat is being shaded by an umbrella while his wife is facing directly into the sun. The human ungraciousness of this setup is disturbing, and this scenario is a constant lifestyle for gurus like Rawat. Adi Da and Ammachi and Sai Baba and all the others live with identical dynamics. Rawat stands with folded arms across his chest/stomach as he is being gazed upon. Each person thrills at arriving at his or her rare close perspective. The intensity of admiration far outweighs star-worship in Hollywood. It's quite disturbing to those of us who think of Rawat as a fellow human being. Rawat is not a sexy movie star, nor a political powerhouse. His command of attention is based on the assumption that he knows something about life that ordinary humans do not know. This is a charade. It must disappoint Rawat from time to time that he is entirely illegitimate and his followers are forced to work diligently on campaigns to create a pseudo-legitimacy for him. It also must disappoint him, and disappoint his followers also, when all these efforts go unrewarded by any degree of success. I am sure that both Rawat and the premies force themselves to settle for the meagerness of Rawat's success in this world. What is hard to figure out is the length of time some people are willing to spend kicking a dead horse. (Aside from chasing the guru, there is that other aspect of Knowledge in which we humans struggle with our condition and try to figure out life, the universe, love, truth and so forth - but that's another topic).
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Wrestling match!!! You made me spit my coffee!!! Hilarious.
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thats totally funny...the wrestling match..can Michael Jackson be in the audience at least in a Mala?
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Actually that link wasn't the best as the pic was rather old (in more recent pics Kim Il looks more like Rawat's cousin) and the accessible part of the article didn't mention Kim Il's well documented penchant for cognac ! Yes,really! Wrestling....yes please.I'll be a baying middle aged lady in the front row.
Modified by lexy at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 12:47:38
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how's that for understatement?
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I looked a lot at those photos and I just feel that this isn't what the Rawat face we knew when he was younger would look like at this age. I don't mean this anymore in a mean way...but just to state the truth...we have had reports he has been a heavy smoker and alcoholic since he was a young teenager. We also know about the ulcer as a teen, and alcoholism and a tendency toward GI distress that early could ravage his body. I am just as guilty of making fun of his appearance as anyone. He created the environment where we worshipped his physical form. But I worry a little about the idea that Rawat could die relatively young from his self inflicted wounds. I really think he looks like he is on major doses of steroids. He might be ill and maybe that is part of the umbrella business. Not to deny the obvious worship that all the pictures imply and how bizarre it looks that he is the only human worthy of a little shade in the photos.
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I feel an uncomfortable feeling myself just for the humanity of his body. It scares me the way it has changed. I do feel guilty myself a bit at poking a little fun at that. My first impression when I saw the small picture in the middle (portrait style), was of someone shrinking, reminiscent of that terrible rapid aging disorder that effects children. His wan and unconvincing smile reminded me of a picture I remember of a little girl who was old aged at 12 or so. Her smile in this case was very moving as she tried to put a brave face on it.
But the instant effect, to my mind, seeing that picture of Maharaji was as if watching an aged and infirm person smiling weakly as they slid slowly but inexorably away down a long tunnel. Literally I felt a tingly shiver go through me.
But the umbrella, it's a bit of a tradition, even back in the days of Rama, the umbrella or parasol was often seen being held, probably, by that same guy..
Modified by Saph at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 13:26:48
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Yeah, I saw a post that led to that a few months ago. Thought I should read it but forgot. Is it any good? Might order it.
Interesting observation with the pied piper and the shaving foam pied flute dancer, but certainly the actual similarity is a lot more serious. Maharaji danced and, well, waved his flute around a bit, and the youth of a generation followed him into the darshan tunnel and under his spell for many long years, and their parents never saw them.
Modified by Saph at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 17:24:08
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I frankly thought the author sometimes seemed to be reaching a bit with the facts to make them neatly fit into his theories. It was interesting but I would not say it was the best book about cults or cult leaders I have read. It does however have an excellent title. I agree...he led us children away with his song...but I don't think our parents sold us out to get rid of vermin!
Modified by Susan at Wed, Oct 11, 2006, 19:43:54
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