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"I lament the loss of that feeling of connection a little, that feeling of certainty that I'm on the right path, doing the right thing etc. that I used to have when my 'faith' was intact......the decisions I've made in recent years have been vastly more informed and empowering than ever before....." Newdawn
Hello everybody! Its been quite a while since I've posted, but I've kept an eye on the forum and finally feel the compelling urge to chime in. First, thank you Newdawn and all of you who post here, for your blatant honesty and realism. We have all been through a lot and it helps to talk about it.
Right in the prime of life, I really did turn the reigns of my life over to a con artist; completely. Along with that I was provided with a belief system that replaced any sense of good judgement or even rational thought. In hindsight, it really was an escape mechanism where I purposely and intentionally withdrew from society, fought hard to destroy my own instincts, and replaced the resulting void with the Rawat Doctrine. And the Rawat Doctrine was so complete and touched so many aspects of my identity, that it conveniently displaced the need to develop coping mechanisms. In some ways I'm embarrassed to even say that. But for a 34 year time span, from my early 20's to mid 50's, my goal was to self-destroy all semblance of who I was.
I have had to accept that and take responsibility for it. The pain of acceptance has been unbearable at times. For several years I posted feverishly to help purge the residue, the sense of loss, and the guilt, about what I had done with my life. Through the kindness, compassion, and mutual understanding of this forum, I was able to create a new baseline of identity for myself. But the emotional pain of just that part of the process was excruciating at times. It took years for me to come to terms with what I had done.
Then, the rebuilding process began. This too has been painfully slow. At first I had to begin to trust my own mind. That hasn't been easy after decades of believing my own mind was my foremost enemy. But slowly I was able to start to think through things, examine information, and actually make intelligent, fact based decisions. The results of that have been fantastic! I discovered that I have an amazing ability to dissect problems strategically, weigh out solution based options, and make good choices. This has translated into success in business and a whole new way to create healthy relationships. With my intellect relatively in tact and as a natural mechanism of self defense, life has taken on an entirely new perspective, and it is good. In essence, I've had the chance to start over.
I'm still very curious about God and Creation, and what it all means. But it seems that all of the answers to those kind of questions are just not available. We can guess, but does anyone really know? After years of seriously intent meditation followed by a decade of continuous self examination, it seems like there would at least be some clues. And there are.
Here's what I know at this point; We are born, we live, and then we die. All of us share an incredible instinct to live and we are also instinctively curious. These instincts can translate in all kinds of ways, but we seem to have a choice about how we decide to interact with just about everything. For years, I used the Rawat Doctrine to make decisions. But since "exing" I've learned that the same rational mind that I tried so diligently to destroy, really can help make good decisions and assist in understanding at least part of the mysteries of life. We can choose to actively direct our awareness and influence the outcomes of much of our existence. What a gift that is.
Based on that limited understanding, I have purposely decided that the best way to manage these instincts is to embrace a sense of wonder and discovery about life and all that it has to offer. And then nourish those innate feelings of gratitude that we are even able to do that. Instead of denying my true identity and replacing it with something else, I'm learning to accept. That means first, accepting things the way they are, then trying to promote change for the better as appropriate, and last, honoring feelings of gratitude.
This is about as far as I have been able to progress, but maybe that's good enough for now. I read my Journey again yesterday and it seemed like it was written by another person. I just felt terrible for the person who wrote that (me!). Fortunately I guess that means there is some separation from those very compromised years. I did learn some things from the Rawat years however, even though what I've learned is ironically just about the opposite from what we were taught. The foremost being to accept myself, embrace my mind and all my natural instincts, and try to make good decisions. These are not easy things to learn. I obviously had to learn them the hard way. Thanks to everyone for your unwavering support.
Modified by jasper at Sun, Apr 16, 2017, 11:21:06
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Thanks Jasper, what a good post and I am glad to hear things are going well and the healing continues.
yes there is no way to overplay what a disaster it was joining Rawat's religious cult at such a crucial juncture in our lives. But even tho we cannot escape the consequences of being hoodwinked for all those years, we are certainly stronger and better people for all the work it takes to recover.
I am feeling like a kid out of school today - ding dong the tenant has gone. He's left a bit of a mess but not much damage and he has gone gone gone. phew. What is surprising me is that for all the shaking I have done over the last few months, how rapidly I am bouncing back.
Modified by lesley at Sun, Apr 16, 2017, 17:30:42
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I rarely come here these days but I am inspired to read these posts. Thanks for reminding me once again that it was here 17 years ago that I was able to rediscover myself and walk away from 29 years of being involved with this cult. I now feel so grateful to be able to wake up in the morning and just live in a way that I could never have done before. Yes, I see PWK Enjoying their lives, attending conferences etc but it is a conditional existence and and I now live a simple but enjoyable life free from reliance upon a cult mentality. It is a liberating feeling and I am so grateful to those who helped me rediscover myself. Thank you so much. Good luck to all who have found the courage and wisdom to throw away the crutches and walk to your own beat. OldTimer
Modified by Old Timer at Fri, Apr 21, 2017, 00:12:20
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Thank you Jasper and all those who helped have helped me over the years. Happy Spring days
Modified by Old Timer at Fri, Apr 21, 2017, 00:16:57
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Hi Jasper. Nice to hear from you here on the forum. I am glad to hear that you are doing well. All the best, Roger.
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We are a subset aren't we? humans > humans who heard about Rawat >humans who fell for it > humans who left > humans who dare to try to understand it > on the internet for all to read Thank you much appreciate the company
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Thanks for all of your contributions over the years, Jasper. I'm glad to see that you have found your way forward.
Marianne
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Jasper, thank you for your continued posts. Your observations of Guru Ji "in private" have been priceless. He seems like a caricature of himself though, in the public realm. Always strutting about proving his immeasurable worth and value to the unsuspecting initiate.
For all intents, the last time I saw him was in 2010. I brought a client to see him, and she remarked afterwards that "Your Guru is quite a showman". He was nothing more than a quirky entertainer and new age schmoozer. Always keeping his exposure to such a narrow scope while controlling the presentation by a carefully scripted appeal to the "better self" (subliminal pandering).
It was shortly after that show (program) that I bailed. And yes it took some mental and emotional gymnastics to land on my feet.
Funny I came to similar junctures many times in my early years but could never follow through....to practically expunge his influence from my life. I guess it took a personal melt down to finally seal the deal.
I remember one time back in the heady days of 1976, the year of the Great Ashram Mutiny. I had been living the monastic life for three years and one day I went up to my superiors and announced that
" I was going on vacation ". It was such an odd pronouncement that they couldn't quite find a reason to protest and said "ok, where are you going ?"
One of my ashram roommates had a brother, who was a wild back-to-nature homesteader. He lived in a 200 year old cabin in the mountains of North Carolina with no electricity or indoor privy. This seemed like a perfect get-away from the travails of that era, and (along with a community premie and his wheels) within a week the whole plan was hatched and off we went.
We met Ray, a soft spoken country soul who hunted ginseng at night, plowed his field with a draft horse, had no use for eastern spirituality, fed cigarettes to his goats, and ran piping to the spring up the hill for gravity water. We woke every morning to the absolute quiet of the wilderness, did some chores to help around, and then set off to explore the hills.
Every afternoon I would wander down to a nearby meadow that we called the Green Field. I would sit and meditate for hours...until the grasses and the buzzing insects seemed like distant trifles. It was sublime and peaceful and nourishing and beautiful.
As the time went by, we forgot about everything chaotic and demanding back in DC, and fell into a rhythm of simple days and fun evenings talking around candles and camp fires. We consumed no inebriants so this was not an "enhanced escapade" of any sorts.
At the end of my "vacation" I returned to my ashram and community and re-adopted the codes, conduct and mannerisms of premie life.....for about five days.
Then I went back up to said superiors and announced that "I was Moving Out Of The Ashram". I had been liberated and freed of the contrived conventions of our quack religion and was opening up a new chapter in my life. Here's the odd twist. Several years later I moved Back into the ashram.... and began the long descent into the quagmire of something...I never knew exactly what. Yes I got closer to him, yes I got to be a part of bigger pond, yes the people around him seemed weird, and he... he was nothing more than aloof.
All came crashing down somewhere around 1981 (for me) and off I went never to really comprehend what it all meant, just a shadow practice and annual pilgrimage to programs...hmm very strange.
So it took another 35 years to complete the visionary emancipation that seemed so evident in the mountains of North Carolina. Now I have crossed my personal Rubicon and I am happier for it. I have never looked back.
I am pleased to report that the grasses still wave to and fro, the insects still buzz in busy reverie. And the Green Field is now in my own back yard. Nothing was really lost was it ?
Thanks to all who post here.
MB
Modified by Manincar at Tue, Apr 18, 2017, 20:46:16
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wow that was great! Thank you. Want to say to Rawat a big FU the kids are just fine.
Modified by Susan at Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 09:38:38
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Thanks Jasper Newdawn Maninar and all. Very interesting posts. I think my predominant feeling these days, getting on for 20 years down the line, is one of fascination. I remain intrigued and perplexed by the whole cult dynamic thing. I interact occasionally with premies on Facebook and witness their undying devotion to their hamster.. ( genuine typo!). It fascinates me. How did I carry on believing for so many years? How can they carry on in the face of the evidence? I couldn't. Once I'd read the whole truth about him, I was out. So maybe they still haven't dared to dig deeper. It wasn't an easy journey untangling the complex cult web, but I am so glad I did.
One conversation recently really had me wondering. A friend of a friend sent me a friend request and told me he had once read and posted here and that I was the only one who was civilised!! After a long conversation involving several others on FB, he asked me about my story and how I came to M and K, I told him everything but despite all I said and all he must have read here he still said " Of course I wonder why you no longer appreciate knowledge. what happened?"
What indeed? Like I say, fascinating!
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just thinking about it yesterday - it seems everything was more or less a preparation for when you die - this life - what you become or can offer didnt matter
nothing really mattered except devotion - much of ambition was deemed fraught - because it didnt matter in this life.
everything felt - and i mean everything - like i should feel guilty about not putting in enough effort to become this perfect devotee
dont put any effort to become this or say that - because it was just a distraction to becoming one with god
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also Brian S has made such an interesting post just down the page.
If we are still talking in our 80's what even more interesting and succinct posts we will be making. I keep hoping I will be able to do life the universe and everything laid out in one post. ha ha.
yeah definitely - religion is about getting ready to die and the last people who should be presented with it are young people getting ready to make their way in life. I knew this even as a premie I was worried about all the sitting around indoors. I knew it wasn't good for me to be sitting cross-legged for hours and oh god I still wince at the hours of dreadful boredom I endured watching videos - I think I had stockholms syndrome towards the end, it flipped and I was wasting my life if I wasn't watching videos and then I'd put a tape on in the car!!! oh blimey, I do feel sorry for my past self.
I am playing bridge this afternoon. It is far more interesting than listening to Mr Rawat blather on about life the universe or anything at all for that matter and all it is is a game of cards.
Pat my old friend and teacher is too blind and frail to play at club any more but she is still the best player in the shire. She's the only person I know to admit to it but I agree with her there are two types of bridge players. The systems players and the intuitive wingers. It will come as no surprise for me to say I am a winger, so is Pat. She hides it to this day. well she admits it to me but if she hadn't hidden it she wouldn't have got good players to play with her and she likes to win.
I don't have to hide it any more because I have got a good reputation for my play. And basically I don't need to because my point is I am the logical one. The systems player is the superstitious one. While I am free to think about it, the systems player is busy conforming to a system that cannot cover every situation anyway.
What's true is true.
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Thanks for directing me to Brian's post, I had missed it. It's in the baby and bathwater thread.I haven't had such an epiphany as his, but every day holds something fresh and wonderful. Seeing clearly through my own eyes is still a struggle sometimes, but finding myself on my own after so many years has brought unexpected benefits. It is easier to access my free will unencumbered. Hey ho.
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yeah, I guess we are not really made for solo living but there is this nice thing of getting to know yourself. xox
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Yes indeed, that nice and most necessary thing of getting to know yourself.Giving myself permission to love doing that in all circumstances at the moment. Sometimes I wonder if I liked meditation because it was often my only alone time and I need it scheduled in
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Thanks everybody. Appreciate your support.
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I feel like we're all kindred spirits here. The determined effort to annihilate our own sense of identity and independent worth in a deliberate cult induced effort to empty ourselves to be filled with (can't even write it!)... To heal from that and rebuild ourselves from scratch is such a proud and noble accomplishment: we end up better and stronger in the end.
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It is a gift to have this forum to both read and express and find kinship in the shared and fairly unusual experience of leaving this particular cult.
Through connection, listening and being heard, growth happens. It's a natural process that I cut myself off from in increments as I got further involved in the illusions of the cult. I found it hard to be myself I had deeply held beliefs that I didn't believe were beliefs that i hardly ever shared because although the special K was only shared word of mouth anyway (and I was very lucky to come across it, obviously) I didn't share about it because a) it was ridiculous and made my friends go all quiet and b) the master of the time had dictated to us that he should be the one to share about it because we were hopeless Is that a convoluted enough place to start from in terms of being one self or what?
At times I go through periods of isolation, almost an involuntary reaction to when things are confronting or especially when there is evidently some currents of unrevealed emotion swimming beneath the surface. That sort of atmosphere was downright normal within the confines of cult interaction and the more I identified the more it became me too. Perhaps withdrawing is not always the best use of my free will. Trying just to be open minded about new ways to deal with things, and when I look at what that means, what an opportunity! As Brian S said in the post above, the canvas is blank now Thank you all, it's good to grow together
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