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Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video
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Posted by:
Jean-Michel ®

09/09/2004, 08:53:38
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"No Apprehension" video, made out of selected excerpts. Here is the whole paragraph:

This whole sphere, this whole world of Knowledge and the Master and, practicing, and devotion, and participation and all that— This is traditionally in India is called the path of devotion, bhakti marg. All the Masters came from this. All the Sikh gurus came from this. All the Masters you talked about came from this. It is regarded as the highest path, inclusive of Buddha— Because any time, any time there is a Master, wants to talk about a living thing, boomf. That's where they find themselves. And, amazingly, enough, it is not called the path of enlightenment, and it is not called the path of Knowledge, and it is not called the path of service, and all of those things, inclusive, it is then given the name. And the name is devotion.







Modified by Jean-Michel at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 09:16:15

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Buddha?
Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
toby ®

09/09/2004, 09:24:20
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rawat knows nothing about buddha. neither does he understand what christ is. the ability of devotion is a high skill, no doubt.

but it is only a part on the path. not the vehicle to make one guy fatter and fatter, that isn't even able to control himself.
with devotion alone you may become the slave of an immoral, deeply corrupted creature, named rawat.

this shows clearly that rawat sticks to the same old story, when he started to change the exterior outfit.

"without complete surrender it will never going to work, still"
his words.

so we start with some kind of a self-knowledge, and in the end somebody must tell the new people that they have to give up their lives, to have it work. so if you are sincere, give up your life for it. if you may find that this knowledge is not for you, you may have sacrificed all that is important to live. the ability to think properly for instance.

toby






Modified by toby at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 10:03:40

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Sure, I'll have some Buddha, easy on the renunciation please
Re: Buddha? -- toby Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Sanford ®

09/09/2004, 10:30:40
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This whole sematic thing is such a joke. Is he expecting to transmit with his eyes or his word subtlties(?) that he IS the Buddha? I think so...kinda like if I said "only the Poobah can walk backwards blindfolded on a balance beam and not fall off, and by the way, it just so happens that I can do that..." I think he is doing the same thing to newcomers now that he did to us, only the volume is way down low on the God identity thing, but it is there nonetheless.

Buddha goes into a pizza palace and says "Make me One with Everything"
So the guy makes him one with everything and Buddha gives him a $20 bill and the guy walks away and does not come back.
Buddha say to the guy: "Hey, where is my change?"
The guy says to Buddha: "Surely you know, Buddha, change comes from within."

nyuk nyuk






Modified by Sanford at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 10:33:43

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How does Geaves define "boomf"?
Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jim ®

09/09/2004, 09:35:10
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Hi JM,

Well that's pretty damning, I should think, even though -- let me guess -- Geaves or EV will define "boomf" in such a way as to make this all go away.

How recent is this video?  How could one prove, to Wikipedia, say, that this is current stuff?

Thanks







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Re: How does Geaves define "boomf"?
Re: How does Geaves define "boomf"? -- Jim Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jean-Michel ®

09/09/2004, 09:41:22
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I'm going to find out.
Someone just posted this today on the French forum !





Modified by Jean-Michel at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 09:47:41

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Here's the details
Re: How does Geaves define "boomf"? -- Jim Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jean-Michel ®

09/09/2004, 12:10:39
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"No Apprehension"
Restricted Use
Video - 18:59 min.
010427V2 / NR

It's been broadcasted in March 2002,
for 'premie use only', I guess,
that's what 'Restricted Use' means in EV's jargon .......
(there are some tapes still around)

JM






Modified by Jean-Michel at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 12:12:21

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Can you get me a copy of the video?
Re: Here's the details -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Guru Maharaji ®

09/09/2004, 15:58:54
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How can we do this?






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Re: How does Geaves define "boomf"?
Re: How does Geaves define "boomf"? -- Jim Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
toby ®

09/09/2004, 12:23:15
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Zappaz is not interested in having this material. i have read
in wikipedia for a while. zappaz is telling there that he is studying the satsangs and material for 10 month.he said that after he made a mistake in defending rawat with exact source knowledge, too quickly. but he is participating in wikipedia for 6 or 7 weeks. that to me is suspicous. i don't believe that anybody is investigating for so long if he doesn't get paid for it or similar.

toby






Modified by toby at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 12:24:32

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Devo-lution
Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Dr.wow ®

09/09/2004, 18:02:27
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This bhakti BS has served gurus well since who knows when. I wonder if the origin of the Indian word "bhaksheesh" is - bhak for devotion and sheesh for those dumb enough to believe it(myself included). I wouldn't be surprised if there were cro magnom or neanderthal creatures, pounding chests, demanding food and fealty for shamanistic favours. Excerpted below is more from Hans Yog Prakash. Like father like son.

DEVOTION TO THE GURU

You will not get the privilege of having a human body again and again. You had better give up worldly pleasures, Kabir, and love your Guru.

A piece of gold does not lose its value if you drop it in a puddle. In the same way, whatever body a soul may take, any devotion which it has acquired will not be lost.

Devotion is very hard to come by, it cannot be reached without Truth. The path to devotion is very narrow, and sharp as a sword’s edge.

Devotion to the Guru is no easy job, it is a razor’s edge path. He who wavers is lost. Only the resolute can survive.

O Kabir, you may have a keen desire for devotion to your Guru, but how can one be a humble servant unless first one removes every other desire from the mind completely?

Devotion is the raft that brings salvation. One who climbs aboard is a saint. But lazy men keep on drowning one lifetime after another.

As long as you have any ties to this world, you cannot have devotion. As soon as you cut all your ties to this world, and put yourself to remember the Lord, you will be known as a devotee.

Without devotion you will never make it to safety, no matter how you try. Only he who has love for the True Name can reach the Kingdom of Heaven.

When Guru helps you, you will receive devotion. He who has both love and devotion is the most fortunate of men.

There is no way you can copy devotion. Imitation devotion falls apart in time of danger, as the leaves quit the trees in winter.

If you try to grab at devotion, your grasp will soon falter. Few are those devotees, maddened by love, who can truly hold fast to the Satguru.

Without the complete and perfect Knowledge, the heart cannot know any peace. Artificial devotion cannot hold the appearance of love for very long.

The devotee who knows the truth dies daily, for he longs to give up his sense of his own importance. An ignorant man cannot understand this mystery.

Greed undermines one’s understanding, and self-seeking and pride cause one to lose devotion.

People who are full of desires, bad temper and greed can never be devotees. Maybe one in a million forgets caste, creed, colour and family, and has true devotion.

O Kabir, life is worth nothing unless one has devotion for the Satguru. It is like so much smoke which dissolves in an instant.

Whoever is truly impartial can have devotion. Whoever has no illusions can have Knowledge. Whoever makes no distinctions in his mind can attain salvation. Whoever is without greed can dissolve in his Lord’s Lotus Feet.

True devotion keeps the mind perfectly in balance at all times. The true devotee lives modestly, he does not make a distinction between "mine" and "thine."

O Kabir, all my doubts have dissolved as a result of devotion to my Guru. To go for a day without devotion would be complete torture.

So long as one’s devotion is mixed with desire, it cannot bear fruit. O Kabir, why should the Lord, the Desireless One, come before one who is full of desire?

The seed of devotion does not change. It is the same now and for ever. One may be born in the families of beggars or king, it makes no difference. A saint will always be a saint.

Devotion is like a toy. Anyone can experience it. Kabir says, in devotion there is no difference between a king and a beggar.

No one can reach God without devotion to Satguru. He alone can give Knowledge of the Supreme.

Only by devotion to Satguru can you receive Knowledge of the Supreme. All scriptures sing the praises of devotion to the Perfect Master.

He who has as much devotion for his Guru as he has for God is called a great soul. His heart is illumined, afire.

TO LIVE WITHOUT GURU

There are some people who pass their entire lives without ever receiving Knowledge from a Guru. You should know that their lives are meaningless. Whatever they do, it is all in vain.

People who talk about the practice of the presence of God, but who are not the disciples of the Satguru, are like prostitutes who proclaim they would gladly die for love of their clients, says Kabir.

Lustful women who pay no heed to the words of Satguru, but make a show of modesty on the outside, says Kabir, become bitches who moan wherever they go. A king who has no devotion for the Guru is no better than a Bullock, says Kabir. He is good for transporting things from one place to another, but that is all.

What use is a temple, unless Satguru is worshipped there? What use is this human frame, unless we have Knowledge of the Self? Even if a million moons were to rise tonight, you couldn’t see clearly without the grace of Satguru.

There is a lightening flash in the sky. Only those who have a Guru will get you home in safety. There is a flash of divine light in the sky within you. Only those who have a Guru are able to see it. They alone will reach their final destination in safety.

You may try a thousand times, and try again, says Kabir, but without the grace of the True Guru, you will never understand the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven. It is only by the grace of the Guru that the mind can be controlled.

Without Guru there cannot be Knowledge. Without Guru there can be no salvation. Without Guru, Truth cannot be realised. Without Guru, you cannot shake of your bad habits.

The saints divide devotees into two types. The first type is he who approaches a Perfect Master because he understands that he has need of his spiritual guidance. He is called one who believes in his Guru, because he gives his life in service to his Guru.

The second type is known as one who follows his mind. He approaches the Guru because he sees that other people are coming to him. Although he has a Guru he continues to follow the dictates of his own mind, and continues to do only those things which he himself wants to do. This is why he is called a disciple of mind, while the other type of devotee is known as a disciple of his Guru Maharaj Ji.

When he wishes for the means to experience the essence of Truth, the devotee must accept a Guru. In the spirit of adoration, he should salute his noble Guru who is God Himself, who is enthroned in the thousand jewelled crown.






Modified by Dr.wow at Thu, Sep 09, 2004, 21:07:24

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he wants to dust off that crown and shake that booty again.
Re: Devo-lution -- Dr.wow Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
bill ®

09/09/2004, 21:21:47
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Re: Devo-lution
Re: Devo-lution -- Dr.wow Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
PatD ®

09/10/2004, 22:13:04
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These holy roller type hindus have been around for quite some time, but not since forever, only from about 1850, & I reckon Shri Hans was at the lower end of the food chain before he slipped on the bar of soap.

Kabir seems to be a big reference for them. It'd make for an interesting study in comparative religion, not to mention literature, if someone could make a correspondence between the troubador notions of courtly love, & those of  the Indian ecstatics. They were approximate  in real time.

I couldn't do it .

I think it's a project for Dr. Geaves. lol

Anyway, here's an extract from Kabir's Songs, in which to my mind he reveals himself.

I am neither pious nor ungodly

I live neither by law nor by sense

I am neither a speaker nor hearer

I am neither a servant nor master

I am neither bond nor free

I am neither detached nor attached

I am far from none: I am near to none

I shall go neither to hell nor to heaven

I do all works, yet I am apart from all works

Few comprehend my meaning: he who can comprehend it, he sits unmoved.

Kabir seeks neither to establish nor to destroy. 

Make of that what you will, but it seems to me Fatboy's Daddy was an unscrupulous cherrypicker who relied on the ignorance of his audience to make a living, & as you rightly say......like father like son.







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Re: Devo-lution - interesting quote
Re: Re: Devo-lution -- PatD Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
nemesis ®

09/10/2004, 22:42:40
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That quote from Kabir really says a lot by saying nothing - LOL!

I really enjoyed that - thanks.







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BLAME IT ALL ON A STUPID BAR OF SOAP!!!
Re: Re: Devo-lution -- PatD Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Dr.wow ®

09/11/2004, 21:33:27
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You made me realize that if it weren't for that f----n piece of soap I probably wouldn't have wasted 20 years of my life and none of us would be here kvetching.

I reckon Shri Hans was at the lower end of the food chain before he slipped on the bar of soap.

I heard that is how he ended up slipping on the bar of soap and slipping this mortal coil. He had a chain of laddoos hanging in the shower stall and when he stooped down towards the lower end . . . well, you know the rest.







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Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video
Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
PatD ®

09/10/2004, 20:23:34
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What a wanker!

Sorry Prem, since the advent of the internet too many people have educated themselves in these hitherto arcane subjects, for you to get away with this illiterate farrago of bullshit, motivational teacher or not. Just a smattering of real knowledge is enough to show you up for a fool .

Apart from the fact that the Sikhs would likely have your guts for garters should you press your claim to be of the line of Nanak, what has Buddha to do with Sikhism?

Then there's this which I find totally outrageous.

All the Masters you talked about came from this.

Sorry pal, it was you who talked about the 'Masters',you slippery little fuck. Don't tell me you've been reading all that  erudite scholarly stuff written by your professional devotee,Dr.Ron Geaves of Chester College.

Nice to see though that you're retreating back East in your references. No more claims that you're on a par with Jesus Christ, I notice, & as for bringing Mohammed into the big tent.........I dare you.

Piss off.







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Worth having in a good place on EPO ? JHB ?
Re: Rawat on 'devotion' in a recent video -- Jean-Michel Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jean-Michel ®

09/11/2004, 02:45:09
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This is a recent quote, and worth to be shown in a good place.

This is what the 'motivational speaker' is talking about and offering, no less !!!







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