Find

Reload

Overview
  NewestArchive
Admin
Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus
  Forum
Posted by:
NikW ®

10/29/2005, 12:06:36
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




Prem is booked to do a performance in Haridwar on 4th November. Will Satpal be there to welcome his little brother home - or will the Prem Nagar ashram gates have to be boarded up to ensure that the previous violence that errupted between the rival supporters of the two claimants to Hans Ji's inheritance is not repeated ?

4th Nov Haridwar Vicas, Pradicaran Ground, near Chinmaya Degree College, Shivalig, Nagae (B.H.E) Haridwar ,Uttaranchal







Previous Recommend View All Current page Next
What previous violence?
Re: Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Toby ®

10/29/2005, 13:08:03
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators










Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: What previous violence?
Re: What previous violence? -- Toby Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
JHB ®

10/29/2005, 13:52:45
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




Someone, can't remember who, reported that during the family split, there was violence, possibly riots, between supporters of Prempal and Satpal. I seem to remember there might have been deaths, but I'm not sure. Perhaps someone else has better memories of the report.

John.







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: What previous violence?
Re: Re: What previous violence? -- JHB Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jethro ®

10/29/2005, 15:03:50
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




When I went to Maharouli ashram for a Holi festival(83), there were over 100000 premies there.
One day I went out to 'mix with the Indians so Mahraji could show Indians His Western devotees', as Micheal Donner told me to do.
Anyway, I did so and walked along way into the hundreds of tents, chatting, drinking chai etc when suddenly I was surrounded by a group of people asking me about BBJ(Satpal). They were very concerned, but I reassured them that our Prem was the real Satguru. They seemed to be heated, but then out of nowhere a bunch of wpc appeared and walked me out.

I also heard there was fighting between the factions but witnessed none.


(OT)I just remebered the same thing happened to me in 1967 or 68 when I was one of 25 Israel supporters in the middle of 2000 Arabs and Arab supporters in Trafalgar square. After a while, the police came when someone tried to shoot at us and walked us out.
I remember looking back when we were out and thought 'was that me in the middle of that'.
(END OT)

Regards Jethro







Previous Recommend Current page Next
PS : I just rembered something I was told
Re: Re: What previous violence? -- Jethro Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Jethro ®

10/29/2005, 15:21:00
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




During the brothers' battle, Satpal flew into London, where he was met by some wpc members who presented with a black rose, drugged him, and put back on a plane back to India.

I do not know if this happened. It was told to me by Ron Geaves who also told me that a few of Satpal's mahatmas beat up Rajaji.







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: What previous violence?
Re: Re: What previous violence? -- JHB Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Toby ®

10/30/2005, 05:59:40
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




Well that was me. I wondered about "previous" which i translate as "not too long ago" (like "previously on enterprise"). Would have been interesting if that still happens casually. I hosted an eyewitness of those happenings who told me about the killings and riots that were going on during the rift in India.

Toby







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: What previous violence?
Re: What previous violence? -- Toby Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
NikW ®

10/30/2005, 04:12:18
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




The circumstances of violence between Satpal and Prem's respective Indian followers occurred (but may not have been confined to) the 74-76 period. Although on at least one occasion the police were directly involved there are no published contemporary reports that identify the warring factions as belonging to the camps of the brothers Rawat. Both sides seem to have engaged 'deniability'.

I am aware of one western premie who had first hand experience of an attack by one set of followers on an ashram held by the 'other side' - and this seemed to be the pattern of the 74-76 conflict. The UK WPC (World Peace Corp) that was 'attached' to Raja Ji in the mid to late 70s was 'briefed' on this inter ashram violence - this included reports of attackers using guns and knives with resulting serious injuries and deaths.

It seems unlikely that any direct proofs of these events will now surface unless someone can show that contemporary police and newspaper reports can be linked to the Prem or Sat Pal ashrams of the time. What is important though is to disperse the myth of religion, belief, meditation or devotion as being prophylactics against violence. Communal religious violence in India is rife and the Rawat religion is not immune - the individual violence of mahatmas Fakiranand (hammer attack), Jagdeo (child rape), Sampurand (human trafficking) is symptomatic of an underlying malaise that ran unaddressed through all level of the Divine Light Mission. It must be remembered that Hans Ji was for a time associated with the militaristic Arya Somage and although he broke with the AS his own creation, the WPC was developed on AS organisational principles - and Hans Ji never seems to have given any balancing prominence to the Gandhian principles of non violence and tolerance.

As for Prem - his early orations were frequently aggressive in tone and the (at least subliminal - Rawat as Krishna) reference to the Bhagavad-gita - a work predicated on the divinity of war -, set up a paradigm in which personal 'peace' was 'priced' on the inevitability of public conflict.

It's not difficult to see Prem's own violence (albeit a violence that is mostly characterised by a clinical removal from physical contact) - the trainings, the concentration camp of DECA, his sexual predation on devotees, his sustained infidelity toward his wife - as being part of this same paradigm of personal peace (sociopathic gratification) set against an acceptance of violence experienced by others who are mere ciphers of a shadow reality.

Makes you glad you had all those soooo soooo bea-utiful experiences doesn't it ?

Nik







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus
Re: Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
kwts ®

10/29/2005, 13:15:50
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




Do the Indian premies have to have a smart card to attend? Or is it one rule for them and another rule for western premies.






Previous Recommend Current page Next
Trying to divine the mind of God .........
Re: Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
PatD ®

10/29/2005, 16:01:05
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




........or is that Gods, is a funny business. Kinda like trying to write one of those farfetched blockbuster novels when you don't know where the plot's going.

I'd say it's pretty provocative of Prem to upstage big brother Satpal in just about his own back garden, but hey, what do the lives of a few serfs matter when it's time to re-position yourself in the home market.

On the other hand, time heals all, & maybe Satpal is in need of a few suitcases full of cash right now, & so on & so forth, lol.







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Note to Self
Re: Reproachment or Showdown between the Satgurus -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
NikW ®

10/30/2005, 04:17:07
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




Stop making up words !

lets try Rapprochement - and try to find some other use for Reproachment

N







Previous Recommend Current page Next
Re: Note to Self
Re: Note to Self -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
george ®

11/01/2005, 06:56:31
Author Profile

Edit
Alert Moderators




 - and abandon the great Anglo-Saxon tradition?  Perhaps 'reapproachment' might sign better though?  George







Previous Recommend Current page Next


Forum     Back