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Posted by:
NikW ®

03/13/2005, 05:40:57
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Blast from the past stuff for old timers - long and not very intersting article for everyone else:

        http://www.cobizmag.com/articles.cfm?article_id=284

contains this:

It’s not surprising these three entrepreneurs ended up in Boulder, a magnet for counterculture, new-age thinking, healthy outdoor living, and on top of that a college town vibrating with creative ambition. Retzloff and Hassan were followers of the Indian “Guru Maharaj Ji” and had met in 1973 at a gathering in Houston for the guru’s Divine Light Mission, which was headquartered in Denver. Demos himself had embraced Buddism while hitchhiking around India for four years. He came to Boulder to study Tai Chi Chuan, a combination of meditation and yoga, but also to prove that a business model built on environmental stewardship, social responsibility and authentic food could work better than pure capitalism. These three, and many others like them in the late 1970s and early 1980s, would help make Boulder into what it is today — the epicenter, or Silicon Valley, of the natural-foods industry.







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Mark Retzloff and Horizon Organic
Re: Divine Tofu -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/13/2005, 13:25:43
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Mark certainly has done well for himself.  Horizon has become a huge natural food company which has now expanded beyond dairy products.

I think Mark got his start and Rainbow in Denver.  He is most definitely an ex-premie. 

BTW -- I really like Whole Foods but I am told the company is anti-union.  So, I tend to stick with my wonderful "worker owned cooperative" (Rainbow Grocery), which never had anything to do with the Rawat cult, except that some premies used to work there.  They do sell all the Horizon products, however.

I think one of the best developments in food distribution is the growth of farmers markets.  There is one in almost every neighborhood in my city.  There is one about two blocks from my house on Saturday mornings, and it's great, and also a great place for the neighborhood to get together.

Buy locally and support your local organic farmers!






Modified by Joe at Sun, Mar 13, 2005, 13:27:44

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Rainbow
Re: Mark Retzloff and Horizon Organic -- Joe Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Marianne ®

03/13/2005, 15:48:49
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Joe: Rainbow was started by premies. I was around when it happened. Bill Crolius, John David Williams, Janet Crolius, etc.

Marianne

 







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Bread and Circus (now part of Wholefoods)
Re: Rainbow -- Marianne Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Bunny ®

03/13/2005, 16:16:53
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I believe Bread and Circus in New England was also started by a premie. He was very successful and then opened up the "Fresh and Wild" chain in the UK.

Bunny







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Re: Rainbow
Re: Rainbow -- Marianne Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/14/2005, 12:35:48
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Marianne,  I know that premies were involved in starting Rainbow in SF, but my understanding is that it wasn't exclusively premies who started it, and it was never a cult business like the stores in Chicago and Denver were.

By the time I got to San Francisco in 1980, Bill Crolius was still working at the store, but the store was completely worker-owned and most of the workers were not premies.  Rainbow in SF has always remained worker owned and really is a true co-op (worker owned and not customer/member owned).  Rainbow in Chicago claimed to be a co-op, but it never really was for the reasons Babaluji mentioned.   I think Denver was the same way.







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The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: Divine Tofu -- NikW Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Babaluji ®

03/13/2005, 23:17:28
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These PREMIE millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor

What a crock of shit!

This guy is now heralded as some kind of health food wizard and marketing genius, but they don't describe how he and other owners of Rainbow Grocery got their start.

These guys all made on the backs of Divine Slave Labor.  They'd be nobodies if they had to create, sustain, and grow a business that had normal cost structures.

My experience at Rainbow Grocery in Chicago was that it was started by the ashram in order to keep costs down when feeding a large group of people.  Certainly, there was a coordinated effort by ashrams to lower their costs by sending one or more ashram residents to the local wholesale produce markets to buy produce and other goods at wholesale prices.  Eventually, the idea got pushed out as food was purchased and delivered to premie houses. The natural extension was some kind of buying club that with a little seed capital got turned into a retail operation.

And the retail operations, as well as the buying clubs, were staffed by volunteers or ashram premies.  And the community urged non-ashram premies to do Service at the buying club location or the retail operation.

The Rainbow Grocery operations had a distinct advantage over local and established health food stores because Rainbow Grocery had volunteer labor.  Or at worse Rainbow Grocery used sleight of hand tricks to pay workers less than the legal minimum wage and avoided paying all worker related taxes like their share of Social Security and worker's compensation and liability and injury insurance and the like by hiring workers who were forced to sign "Independent Contractor" agreements.  And I believe that David Shimberg of Chicago was responsible for coming up with that concept in Chicago.

For myself, I was an unpaid volunteer at Rainbow Grocery from it's physical inception around December of 1994.  My first paycheck was in May of 1975 for the paltry amount of $40.00 per week, which was substantially less than the Federal minimum wage.  I did not receive any health benefits or any other kind of benefit.  In fact, during that time I had a bicycle wreck and had to go to the Emergency Room to get x-rays and stitches.  When I got the bill from the hospital I had to plead poverty and have them write it off.  Yes, this was an example of Maharaji bringing peace and harmony to the troubled planet.  Well, if only parents still paid to clothe and feed their cult-gone children and hospitals would forego payment and Federal programs would provide Food Stamps and other services.

Oh, and, of course, Rainbow Grocery was a non-profit entity and paid no taxes that most commercial entities are required to make.  Got to love the "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's" premie attitude.

Rainbow Grocery of Chicago became a huge success.  Competitors suffered and complained and filed lawsuits alleging they were driven out of business by slave labor used by Rainbow.  Yes, that's true.  They were, indeed, harmed because of slave labor.  We laughed at them for their lack of understanding of who we were and what we were doing!

At some point the ownership of Rainbow Grocery of Chicago was secretly transferred to Steve Kriston by DLM/DUO/The Ashram for whatever reasons.  Within a year Steve Kriston had purchased a very nice condo right near Lake Michigan.  He was driving a BMW and stores were popping up all over the city.  And, yes, there was a secret store in Evanston that might have been owned by  Atlanta's Jim Hennisson? or some guy named Jim.  Also, see the Word document links to see all the players involved in the final sale of Rainbow in 1994 that put Steve Kriston way over the top as a multi-millionaire.

I remember that one weekend some national DLM big wheel had stayed at Kriston's.  I was there and I saw and was told that the person liked porno and that's cool and that's why they had two porno tapes delivered by a local porno delivery service.  Gosh, how cool and liberated, I thought.  But, they'd really prefer to stay home watching porno than going to hear satsang?  Yes, I was GREEN.

Here's another sick aspect of this dirty business that still bothers me.  Rainbow Grocery was co-op and it really was in the beginning, but soon it was a viable for-profit, but not-paying any local, state or federal taxes.  As a co-op Rainbow would charge members an annual fee of something like $25 or $35 per person or $50 or $60 per household.  If people didn't want to be members they could shop at Rainbow, but they would be charged a 10% surcharge.  I always felt funny when non-premie co-op members would come to the store to do service because we would encourage members to help out just like a lot of food buying clubs and co-ops do.  But it felt funny to me because it felt deceptive since I and other premies were volunteering because we were doing Service for Maharaji.  It just felt dishonest and wrong.

But, the funny story is that Rainbow Grocery was a member of a non-profit food wholesale outfit called GIPC, which stood for Greater Illinois People's Co-Op.  GIPC was a wholesaler who had some really crumby offices and a warehouse on the third floor of a building at Chicago's South Water Produce Market.  They were surviving on a song and a prayer.  But, they were good people who didn't have a guru that were trying to do that co-op thing for people thing that was the rage back then and still is in a few more interesting locales on the planet.

GIPC sold us cheese and whole wheat pasta at a very good price.  But, at the point where Rainbow Grocery was operating a successful retail storefront operation the GIPC board determined that Rainbow was no longer a real co-op and that Rainbow would need to pay a 10% surcharge.  And rightly so, in my opinion, because Rainbow's increasing purchases were straining GIPC's capacity to the point where GIPC needed to expand their operation.  Fair enough, I thought.  Well, good old Steve Kriston, the guy that nobody could get a long with, was rather miffed and complained and whined for a couple of weeks about it. Well, Steve decided, and it was a good business move, to cut out GIPC and buy direct from cheese producers in Wisconsin and get the pasta elsewhere.  It's funny because I believe, and I could be wrong, that a few years later Rainbow bought out GIPC.

The problem I have with Steve Kriston, the tofu king of Boulder and all the other owners or Rainbow Grocery like the one in Seattle is that these people made it off the backs of good natured and naive people who showed up and worked for free under the guise of serving Maharaji.  And then to see these operations turn retail and harm other honest business owners who gave a shit about their workers and paid taxes and minimum wage.  You know, it's nothing short of CRIMINAL.  Yes, CRIMINAL.  And now these CRIMINALS are millionaires getting their mugs pasted into magazines with glowing articles about their entrepreneurship.  Like I said, what a crock of shit colored toe-food.

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/Prem_mark_Colorado.doc

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/Sale_of_PremMark.doc

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/prem_mark_corporate.doc

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/rainbow_grocery.doc

Note: The usual suspects of Bob Jacobs, Donald De Laski, Alvaro Pascotto, John Bale in the above document.

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/slave_labor_letter_page1.jpg

http://www.drek.us/pages/corporate/rainbow/slave_labor_letter_page2.jpg

http://www.unfi.com/

http://www.rainbownf.com/

Hmm, I wonder if one can request or litigate for the rightful wages and penalties associated with SLAVE LABOR?  These people and companies made excessive profits on the backs of SLAVES.

 

 

 

 






Modified by Babaluji at Mon, Mar 14, 2005, 00:22:32

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Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- Babaluji Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
PatD ®

03/14/2005, 09:18:01
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Hmm, I wonder if one can request or litigate for the rightful wages and penalties associated with SLAVE LABOR?

Well, well, well. So you got $40 pw. I got £18 which I reckon was just about the equivalent, in exactly the same set up in England. Now here's something you might find interesting, seeing as you were one of the founder members. Unlike yours,our co-op never made it into the mainstream, & that was because the non premie members, who all belonged to a hard left hippie commune, staged a coup d'etat at a certain point & took the thing in a different direction. They were just as moonstruck & naive as we were in some respects. I could tell you the story of how they invited the Irish 'Peace Campaigner' to address a seminar in the back of the crummy teashop which was part of the business, & I sussed him out immediately as being an IRA man, & he sussed me, that I'd sussed him, without a word being spoken,& I got out of there fast, & then had to serve the Special Branch spook with a bag of peanuts back in the shop, without letting on that I'd sussed him too. It wasn't funny. If you want to know why I often supported Scott's anti Marxist slant then there's part of the reason.I've seen the white's of their eyes.

Anyway,to the point.

Eventually I got kicked out, moved on, went to live abroad, & all that seemed to be in the dim past when one sunny day about 15 yrs later,a letter arrived from England. It was a high octane mindfuck type letter from the law firm handling the demise of the enterprise,& guess what,muggins was still one of the legal owners because he hadn't cancelled his £1 share. All of the anti capitalist slimeballs who'd used every trick in the book to confound the system, had cannily taken the precaution of covering their arses,but when they'd got rid of me those motherfuckers had deliberately not mentioned the neccessity of doing that. It all got sorted out in the end.........but the thought occurs that if it had happened the other way round, & the thing had been successful, then I wouldn't have realised that I still had a stake.







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Did they buy your share back?
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- PatD Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/14/2005, 19:22:11
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And was it worth still the same amount?






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Jesus, that's a complicated question.
Re: Did they buy your share back? -- Joe Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
PatD ®

03/14/2005, 20:49:22
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After the business went bust, 'They' as an entity didn't exist anymore because they'd already sold their nominal shares,if they'd all even had one to begin with. The original legal side of the thing was handled by an individual who split long before the enterprise folded, & all the explanation he gave at the time was, 'sign this & we can start bagging up the muesli'.

Not only that, the business had passed through so many hands & changed its structure so many times by the time it went under, that the 'they' I knew weren't the same 'they' who wound it up. When the receivers went looking for who was responsible for the unsecured debt,the only people they could find was me & 3 other people who hadn't severed their connection with the original legal entity. So we were 'They' in law,& I could hardly sell my share to one of the others, nor they to me: that would have been like playing pass the hot potato.

What I was getting at was the fact that I'd totally forgotten I'd even 'bought' the share in the 1st place, hadn't been associated with the business for years, & was dumbfounded to find I was potentially liable for debts incurred long, long, after I'd given up eating muesli for breakfast. If on the other hand it had become a success, I wouldn't have known that it was really owned by myself & 3 other lucky fuckers.

See what I mean.







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This is an extremely important issue -- we should invetigate more
Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- Babaluji Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/14/2005, 12:31:44
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This is something I've wondered about over the years.  These cult busineses which got started and sustained because they used slaves and didn't really have much in the way of labor costs.  Very few businesses (with the exception of family-run businesses, which have self-limiting growth potential), have that advantage.

I lived in the ashram in Chicago in the mid-to-late 70s and I was on the board of the non-profit Rainbow Grocery for awhile.  The concept was, that the slave labor was appropriate because of the money that was going to go to the cult in spreading knowledge and in supporting Rawat.  The other members of the Rainbow Board at that time were Steve Kriston, David Shiimberg, Linda Smith and "     " Weiss.  (What was his first name?)

Not only were the premie workers at Rainbow paid very little, they had no benefits at all.  A large percentage of the ashram premies worked there.  So, not only were they working for slave wages, they were subsidized by all the rest of us in the ashram who worked in "the world" and supported the ashram, partially allowing these premies to work for tiny wages and no benefits.

I recall at Rainbow Board meetings bringing up the subject of raising the pay of Rainbow workers, because as ashram housefather, I saw how hard it was to make ends meet as the numbers of ashram premies working for Rainbow increased (at one point is was more than half of the ashram).  Anyhow, I was told by Kriston and Shimberg that Rainbow couldn't afford to do that.  We were expanding to a second store, and money was tight.  If they had to pay more wages, there wouldn't have been the money to expand.

So, the idea that some of the honchos made millions out of this is kind of astounding.

What were the names of the premie couple who worked for Rainbow.  I recall one managed the store on the north side, and the other managed the store on Wellington.  They were nice people, and I don't think they made millions (did they?)    I heard they went into the Amtext book-buying cult business in Southern California.

I left Chicago in 1979 and we had just opened the second Rainbow store (and I think this one was called Premark on West Estes Avenue in Rogers Park).  The first one was on Wellington in the Belmont area.

I worked closely with Steve Kriston in getting the construction financing for the second store, and actually went to the bank (Bank of Ravenswood) that financed the loan and negotiated the deal with Steve.

I remember as ashram housefather how little the premies who worked for Rainbow made and how we relied on the other premies who didn't have cult jobs to make up the difference.

So, I guess Steve and Dorie Kriston are living the high life out of all of that.  I don't doubt Steve worked hard in the business, but it should be acknowledged the distinct advantage the business had because of the low wages it paid (again, with no benefits).

The "Jim" you are referring to is probably "Jim Emerson" who had a natural foods store in Atlanta, and was a business honcho in the cult.  He was quite a bit older than the other premies as I recall, and I have to say I never trusted him -- I always felt wary about dealing with him.

Anyhow, I think all of this is a huge issue and I'd love it if more people involved in this (including those involved in the stores in Denver and Seattle (Atlanta, too, I guess).






Modified by Joe at Mon, Mar 14, 2005, 12:42:21

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That's investigate son.
Re: This is an extremely important issue -- we should invetigate more -- Joe Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
dant ®

03/14/2005, 15:45:46
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I didn't work at the stores but I lived in the ashram, well it must have been shortly after you left. I guess around 1980-81. At that time there were the two stores and also a wholesale operation going which not only supplied to the two stores but also many others around Chicago. Their big enemy was Sherwin's who had a store in Hyde Park and also somewhere around Roger's Park I think. (later when I left the cult I used to shop at Sherwin's and at other stores on purpose so as not to support the operation.) I got alot of information from the guy who was the salesman for the wholesale operation, who's name I can't remember at the moment, but we were sort of friends. One of the few ashram premies with whom I could go out to a restaurant after Satsang.

Later a store was opened in Lincoln Park, I think it was Fulton Ave? It was fairly avant garde as it tried to make the jump from esoteric health food coop to mainstream healthfood oriented supermarket. They also sold organic beef. I knew the guy who trained to be the butcher there too, but I forget his name as well. Jim something or other.

I also know a bit of extremely trashy gossip about Steven Kriston which I won't repeat here but let's just say that the money didn't make Steve and Dory happy it would seem. Dory always seemed nice, but I had the feeling that Steve was a machinating jerk. I also remember the house father after you asking Steve to pay the ashram premies more and him saying that it wasn't possible. Even the CC, Kirk Ritchie I think talked to him about that. Because they wanted the ashrams to start being more presentable and it just wasn't possible with the measley Rainbow wages.

Another thing that was very popular at the time was that in addition to the normal "slaves", there were community organized "service nights" where other premies, in and out of the ashram would come and work for some hours for free bagging granola or something. I remember being asked, doing it once and then never again. The whole thing seemed completely weird to me even then, as it just wasn't clear what the "service" actually was. Or in other words, it seemed like it was service to Steve. Even at my young, though business-savvy, age I felt like the whole deal wasn't kosher. Exactly for the reasons you say. Why the hell could all the other health food stores manage to do okay without all the slave labor. And on top of that they had an automatic loyal customer base of premies.

Actually now that I am thinking about it I think I bitched quite a few times to ashram premie friends, the house father and the CC about it for exactly those reasons. It seemed utterly absurd that Steven couldn't pay the ashram premies more and that actually it was anti-service what he was doing, because he wasn't supporting the ashram. I would like to think that my words made a difference with the CC, because I do remember some changes happening.

I really don't know, but I remember that when I got there there was this kind of "holiness" about the stores and no one dared speak against them. So then little ol me came along and planted the seed of doubt. I think probably the CC and some others were privately thinking that too, and that my speaking out helped to bring things to the surface. On the other hand maybe I had nothing to do with it.

But in the end somehow the whole discussion becomes absurd. Is it better that the money went to Steve Kriston or Rawat or whomever else? Somehow it is all irrelevant. At the time, I was really being negative because I thought the money wasn't going to Rawat and his mission. Oh yes, by the way, Steve was already driving around in a big fat Mercedes at that time, while the ashram premies were being underpaid and people were spending their nights bagging nuts.

Okay then, that's all I have to say for now.






Modified by dant at Mon, Mar 14, 2005, 15:50:24

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The evolution of Rainbow Grocery
Re: That's investigate son. -- dant Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/14/2005, 17:53:33
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I was transfered from Chicago in May, 1979.  I remember coming back to Chicago for a brief stay in the Summer of 1980.  I remember the premies had ripped out all the plumbing and were tying to convert the place so it would be presentable for Rawat to stay there.  A lot of the premies had been farmed out to the community.  It was a mess.

Kirk Ritchie -- man, I could tell you stories there...  Strange dude.

The cult was in many ways a very small world, wasn't it?

I remember in 1976, Dory and Steve got married.  Dory had left the ashram to marry Steve, and I think she felt kind of guilty about it, especially when the Catholic Devotional period began, and Rawat began condeming people who had left the ashram and gotten married.  They certainly were not rich then.  Dory came from a wealthy family, I think, but Steve was just paid a salary from Rainbow, as far as I know.  That's what's astounding that he converted that into being a millionaire.

And really, those stores would have never made it were it not for the slave workers, and people like me who supported them in the ashram.  Not to mention the other premies who lived in poverty in the community for the chance to "do service" for Maharaji at Rainbow.

Towards the end of my time there, and I think relating to the "holiness" issue, Maharaji started taking more of a direct interest in the stores, and there was this directive that business is business and we shouldn't act like al cult business anymore.  I remember, for example, that it came down from Rawat that the stores shouldn't close down for Festivals as they had done in the past.  So the ashram premies who worked at Rainbow did a "split shift" and could only go to half of the Kissimee swamp festival, for example, all so that the stores didn't close down.  There was this idea that they were going to be incorporated into the cult's mission more than they had before.

Another example of that was that the Rainbow Groceries in Chicago became more incorporated under the "Premark" umbrella.   I remember a premie being transferred from the Denver ashram who had worked in the Denver Rainbow to be a buyer for the new Rainbow store when it opened in 1979.  Prior to that, ashram premies were not sent to Chicago for the purpose of working at Rainbow. 







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Ok, I'm working on my Chicago Rainbow Daze and...
Re: This is an extremely important issue -- we should invetigate more -- Joe Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Babaluji ®

03/15/2005, 00:38:09
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I'm not going to be pulling any punches.

I'm going to tell everything I know including all of the drug dealing that was going on very much close to Rainbow Grocery.







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Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- Babaluji Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
perspective ®

03/14/2005, 15:14:27
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Jim Emerson and Anthony Castaldi own Rainbow Groceries in Atlanta and both are millionaires.They own the store there. They would thank you I am sure and say 'thats life'






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Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- perspective Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/14/2005, 17:54:58
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Did the ashram premies in Atlanta work at Jim's store as "service?"

I thought that Jim actually owned the store before he received knowledge, but I might be wrong about that.







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That is also what I understood
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- Joe Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
dant ®

03/15/2005, 00:49:35
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But it could be that he gave his store to Rawat.





Modified by dant at Tue, Mar 15, 2005, 00:51:36

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Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- perspective Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Cynthia ®

03/15/2005, 07:20:29
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Yeah, that's a real slap in the face to anyone who ever did work there, isn't it?  "I got mine, so f**k you."

It's the standard, wealthy cult-member, "Oh, stop whining a get a life," bullshit, too.  Disgusting.

 







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Boy, is that ever true -- the cult caste system
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- Cynthia Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
Joe ®

03/15/2005, 11:42:06
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There really was always this sort of caste system in the Rawat cult and it had to do with wealth, usually inherited wealth.

This hit me really hard towards the end of my time in the ashram when I realized that there were quite a number of ashram premies who came from wealthy families, and who pretty much expected that if the ashrams closed, or they left, they would have opportunities available to them, courtesy of their rich families. 

Those ashram premies who came from the working class, and who spent 10 years developing nothing were the ones who REALLY got screwed by Rawat's cult.  They pretty much had to start over in their 30s on every level, because they really didn't have any resources to fall back on, other than themselves.  Because, let's face it, Rawat didn't lift a finger to help them, and even stuck them with the debts of his ashrams.  What a slimeball.  He had the same type of "let-them-eat-cake" attitude, because Rawat never had to work a day in his life for anything, except to the extent he extends effort to be worshipped, to scare the shit out of people, and to (coyingly and subtly (nowadays)), pretend to be God.

I also noticed after I got to Miami, this group of really rich premies like Steve Sordoni and others, who kind of just spent their lives following Rawat around, living high, and perhaps being in the inner circle for no other reason than because they had time and money.

The rich crowd never came to community satsang in Miami, it was way beneath them.  They preferred to hang out at more ritzy places, and/or didn't go to satsang at all, probably didn't practice knowledge, just were part of the jet set crowd, going to every program no matter where it was, and being part of the gopi, stylish, entourage.

One other thing comes to mind.  I remember when the DECA plane project was going on, Rawat personally interviewed some ashram premies to be trained to be stewards or stewardesses on "His" plane, and I recall there was a pattern in the people selected to be interviewed.  They were mostly fairly attractive, and from wealthy families, who they had a somewhat more "refined" vibe to them.  Ordinary, working class, ashram premies were not interviewed, as I recall.  It also seemed to me that some of the Initiators were selected on that basis, including a few who were otherwise fairly nuts and were pretty much incapable of even doing the "service."  Deborah Roettinger comes to mind.  It really shocked me that she got selected.

And then there was always this jet-set crowd of people, wearing designer clothes, who sat in the front rows at programs.  Most of them I never saw, except at those events, up in the front rows, not that I ever sat up there with them.

In fact, the closest I ever sat at an event with Prem Rawat, was in 1990, when I, for the first time in like 8 years, went to see Rawat in San Francisco at the Mariott Hotel, which was a few blocks from my office.  I walked in and they gave me a "ticket" after first trying to hit me up for money.  I declined.  But the seat was like in about the 10th row, the closest I ever sat.  I think I got the seat because I was by myself, I was dressed up in my business suit, and it was just shortly before the program began and they needed to fill all the seats.   In the middle of Rawat's offensive diatribe about how screwed up the "people of the world" are, I got up and walked out.  I guess in that case it woud have been easier if I was in the back.  As I walked out I saw the looks on the faces of the premies as they watched Rawat speak and it creeped me out completely.






Modified by Joe at Tue, Mar 15, 2005, 16:25:06

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Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- perspective Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
AngelaMaria ®

04/07/2005, 18:12:12
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Does any one here know Anthony?






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Which Anthony?
Re: Re: The Premie millionaires were made by Divine Slave Labor -- AngelaMaria Top of thread Forum
Posted by:
JHB ®

04/08/2005, 00:18:49
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AngelaMarie,

Do you mean the one who has posted here? I haven't met him but I have exchanged emails with him.

John







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